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October 19, 2006

Comments

alison

Thank you Andrew. And after having read some of the appauling comments over at LGF relating to this news, this comes as a much needed read! With respect to the capital - yes London is a terrific city. Having been lucky enough to visit quite a few of this earths major cities i prefer London to them all any day. I will never forget the absolute silence that fell in honour of those killed last July. This city has lived through a fair bit, the IRAs attempts are certainly none too distant a memory (for me). Screw the lot of them. And today with this as Al Q cr*p as headline news id like to extend that same screw you spirit to LGFs sad insular little commenters.

Stu

With you on this Andrew, but to be frank I left GB 'cos it just wasn't the place that I was brought up in, Major and Lamont were the last straw for me.
However, the demographics of the Nation have been changed for ever; the result of the ongoing invasion of the last 50 years, the first for a thousand years.
The Muslims will have their State within a State; I see nothing to stop it. The Dutch Justice Minister is already considering the "democratic" arrival of Sharia Law in his own country.

alison

('British spirit'...i should add!)

daytripper

completely unbowed to any form of terror

horse crap, our government has turned into the reactionary fools that the US government has become also.

What I'm trying to say is that terrorists and fanatics will, ultimately, never defeat this nation

they dont need to, our government is devouring it from the inside. al queda cant affect our freedoms and liberties. our gevernments can, and that is sadly what is happening. the terrorists are getting all theat they want. in the years to come all that will be needed to make this an islamic nation is to put a crescent on the flag and build a few more mosques, because we will have all the draconian laws that middle eastern states have. the ones you guys criticise them for.

alison

Rubbish DT.

alison

Also Stu you are reading way too much into the Dutch justice ministers remarks.

daytripper

excellent critique alison.

parcifal

good point DT.
The right always talks about less gov't, the reality is they want more draconian laws, erosion of civil libeties will follow, and before you know it, we'll have Sharia Law in the UK. The truth is only the Left can solve this problem. when Bush is gone we'll spend 10 yrs mopping up after his mess. always the same.

The Phantom

Well it's a rare day that I agree with Andrew, but that day is today.

I am unhappy that the bastards have made the UK the number one target, but I trust and expect that my British friends will exhibit the courage and resolve that they have exhibited in past times.

And I do look forward to flying into London next month.

alison

I just cant be bothered DT to be honest.

The Phantom

daytrippper

I just read your comment.

I know this is the internet, where silly thoughts run free, but...come on. Sounds like a commend I heard days ago saying that "America's civil liberties is worse than Argentina under the generals"

Come on.

notme

McC: I think you're right. I know the meme is out there, that the lights are going out in Europe, but I don't think you can include the UK in that depressing forecast, despite demographics. You can't just can't get rid of what is/was to be British in one generation. Look at the Soviet Union - it imploded and yet Russians are still very much Russian. The Brits I know in the States give the impression of softness and apathy but they are actually quite tough and resolute. The English bulldog might be sleeping under the sofa but he's still there.

Colm

OK, the US had 9/11 and we had the much smaller 7/7 and terrible though they were, they were singular events. Where is the evidence of a major terrorist threat at the moment . They are the only attacks in over 5 years, the entire length of the second world war. One day we may have a major problem with Al Queda or some similar Islamic terror campaign but the truth is at the moment we just don't. We haven't really experienced anything to be brave and fortuitous about.

alison

Colm are you aware how many plots have been stopped and suspects held at the moment? why do you need an actual attack to understand this - or am i misunderstanding you here ( i hope so)

Ernest Young

notme,

Nice to see you have such faith in the Brits, at least in those that have had the sense to migrate westwards. You say they seem, in general to be soft and apathetic, and bear in mind, these are the ones that had the fortitude and foresight to see what was/is happening in the UK. - Doesn't say too much for the rest, does it?

Sad to say, but there is a big generation gap between those born pre 1960's, and those born after. I would put money on it, that most of the Brits you know are of the older kind...

Strange thing, when I talk to Russians and East Germans, many of the older folk actually yearn for the days of communism.

It would seem that the older generation could see the folly of 'free for all comers' style welfare, and the open borders immigration policies, but the younger generation felt differently. You didn't have to be a genius to see to see the decline in the UK, as long ago as the late eighties, as Stu said, Major was the straw that broke the camel's back.

His government didn't make immigrants of us, he made us exiles...

In UK political terms, the Heath/Wilson era was a total disaster, destroying both Education and Health systems, and much else besides. Thatcher did little to stop the rot.

I will be accused of being one of those who bemoan the passing of 'the good old days', - an easy jibe for those who believe that all progress is good, and don't have the wit to see when things are going pear shaped..

The bulldog may well be under the sofa, but he is snoring his head off, having dreams of what might - and should have been...he being rendered toothless by the very people charged with his wellbeing.

aileen

Alison

Colm is not saying that London is not under threat but hasn't yet been tested to the degree that the blitz did, i.e. it is only the things that have happened that are relevant.

daytripper

I know this is the internet, where silly thoughts run free, but...come on. Sounds like a commend I heard days ago saying that "America's civil liberties is worse than Argentina under the generals"

while things are relatively rosy now, i have little faith that things will be so in the future. western politics is slowly baracading itself from the people. with all these powers in place, democracy will be the next target. as tom tyler said on another thread, its not about democracy its about trust in your leader. thats defacto monarchy.
by the time it comes to protest (or dare i say rebel) against what is happening, it will already be too late. anyone who does will be classed as a terrorist and locked up or shot on sight.

i give it 2-20 years.

Terry

I don't think AMcC is necessarily right. Sure, if Britain knows what it stands for it will survive, but if it is suffering from a civilisational crisis of confidence and lacks the will to withstand an evil ideology it will not necessarily win - it may just give up the fight instead.

john

I lived through the Blitz and remember the communal spirit. I had two uncles who came back from Dunkirk and remember the strength in face of what was a very severe reverse. The social and other conditions that bred the people of those days no longer exist. We are hardly a British Nation no more than a Heinz 57 mongrel is a thorough bred Labrador. There is no pride in the country or love of those traditions and attitudes that made Britain what it was in the early 40s.

Ernest Young

aileen,

Having lived in London both before and during the Blitz, I think I have a fair idea of just what bravery and fortitude are required in times of etreme duress.

What I saw on 7/7 was a pale imitation of the real thing, it was just too bureacratic to qualify, but then, as is mentioned, we had five years in which to practice.

The real thing is totally spontaneous, and we didn't have sock puppets in Commisioner's uniforms to cry crocodile tears for us on tv...

With 7/7, we knew it was an isolated incident, similar to the IRA bombings in London, with the Blitz we knew that tomorrow there would be more, and the day after that, and the day after that. There was no end in sight, and that in itself toughens the spirit and determination.

Ernest Young

Well said John,

alison

Aileen he says 'Where is the evidence of a major terrorist threat at the moment'. Im not so sure. Perhaps he can clarify.

alison

Speak for yourself John. My father lived through the Blitz in London. I was born, grew up, work and live in London. I plan on staying. I know plenty of young people who feel differently to what you and Ernest feel now and who are very proud of their city and nationality. Please dont discredit us with your own depressing (Victor Meldrew/M.O.G) outlook.

aileen

Sorry Alison. I missed that bit. What I still think was his main point registered but that fell through.

Ernest Young

alison,

As I mentioned in an earlier comment, there is a big difference in the atitudes and opinions of the different generations.

And while I see your Father lived in London during the Blitz, I get the impression that you did not. Far from discrediting you and your generation, I was merely pointing out the differences in opinions between young and old.

Because we are older, doesn't make us wrong, or vice versa, because you are younger, it doesn't necessarily make you right. After all, we have can compare the two eras, having experienced both, while you only have experience of the present.

We do not need to discredit the younger generation, they do a pretty good job of it on their own!

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