August 01, 2005



"The Transylvanian nation extends through both Hungary and Romania. That doesn't mean that the latter should have representation in the parliament of the former. The Berber nation extends from the Atlantic coast of Morocco deep into Algerian territory. Does that mean Algerian Berbers should be represented in Rabat? I don't think so."

Dear me. Irrelevant, hysterical flatulence.

It is for the Hungarian State to decide who is to have representation in its Parliament. It is for Morocco and its people to decide who is to be granted formal rights within its democtaric chambers. Who speaks in the Dail is a matter for the Dail. Full stop. If they want to give speaking rights to Girls Aloud, they may do so.

Dry your eyes Andrew.

Oh, and before you start talking about "international law", do some reading on the subject for crying out loud - focussing on where it stops and where it starts.

David Vance

If Girls Aloud did gain speaking rights, even I might tune into Dail debates. "It's the sound of the Underground"....how about Nadine for Taoiseach?


Andrew, how is international applicable here but not in the case of the Iraq war? I remember arguments on slugger where it was dismissed as nonsense!

Andrew McCann


Care to address the fact that no other domestic parliament in the world allows people from another country to have representation?

I fear the flatus is in your own pyjamas, matey.

And I think I know more about international law than you will ever know. At the end of the day it IS for the Dail to allow who it wants to be represented. It is also for Unionists to provide the maximum resistance to absorption, by openness or by stealth, into governance by the Irish.


"It is also for Unionists to provide the maximum resistance to absorption, by openness or by stealth, into governance by the Irish."

What do you mean by 'stealth' Andrew? Would this include violence?


How sad that you think your place in the UK is so insecure that someone from NI sitting in the Dáil is 'unification by stealth.' As, for David, is a visit by Mary McAleese or having members of the Irish police working in NI.

And despite your renowned expertise on international law, it seems to have escaped your attention that people from the UK sitting in the Dáil doesn't actually mean that the UK will be subject to Irish law.

I suspect that the Union is just a teenchy bit safer than you like to think: Parliament is still sovereign here and, last time I looked, Gordon Brown was getting his mitts on my taxes!

On other parliaments, well the UK's parliament allows citizens of commonwealth countries and citizens of the Republic of Ireland to run for and sit in Parliament.

It may disappoint you to know, though, that there is a common law ban on 'idiots' and lunatics (at least in their non-lucid moments) sitting in the Commons. So you'd better keep the day job!

Andrew McCann


You're missing the point. Of course it doesn't mean that the UK will be subject to Irish law. What it means is that the process of neo-functionalism will kick in, and nationalists will eventually insist on all political matters being dealt with the Dail.

If the United Kingdom gave some ground on that, you'd have the genesis of joint sovereignty - an outcome rejected by the majority in Northern Ireland.

Your arguments about our parliament allowing Commonwealth citizens to stand as MPs is not even a remote analogy. Ronald McDonald could stand if he wanted - PROVIDING HE REPRESENTED PEOPLE IN A UK CONSTITUENCY. That's the crux: it's the venue, not the person.

As for the jibe about lunacy, I'd expect better from someone I previously had respect for, whatever our disagreements. Don't try to out-do me in the sarcastic vitriol. I promise you you'll lose.


Ah I thought it was a good jibe!

David Vance


I was happily contemplating Nadine as Taoiseach! As for Mary McAleese and Garda in NI - aaargh!!


"the process of neo-functionalism"

What on earth does that mean in plain English?

BTW - Strictly speaking Ronald McDonald as an American citizen (alright I know he's fictional for the pedants out there) could not stand for our parliament.

Also, no matter how much republicans might start trying to insist once they had representation in the Dail that should become the place where political matters for Northern Ireland are dealt with, it simply wouldn't happen. It's not feasible. Relax Andrew. There's no smoke without fire and in this case there's no smoke and no fire.

Oilbhear Chromaill

The history of Ulster from 1912, or indeed 1873, should prove that. 

1912 - wasn't that when the first terrorist grouping of the modern era, the UVF, was founded?

Incidentally there's a theory, not without substance, that the Germans saw the founding of the UVF and the trouble it was causing the British Govt, as its cue to get involved in WW1 on the basis that they thought the Brits had trouble enough.

So the senseless slaughter of thousands of "Ulster" men on the Somme could be said to be the fault of the Unionist leadership....

Madradin Ruad

1912 - wasn't that when the first terrorist grouping of the modern era, the UVF, was founded?

Nope - The IRB predate the UVF by many years.

David Vance


Welcome to Planet Earth. Any more great conspiracy theories? Did you hear that the Jews were behind the Holocaust? Honestly..


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