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July 31, 2006

Comments

ed

I actually wouldn't be surprised to learn (the only thing that would surprise me would be that anyone dared to enquire and find out)that the children and women had been concentrated there deliberately and then the Israelis incited to fire. There really is no depth of depravity to which the jihadis will not sink. I think the EU Ref blog has nailed the reality of this: that the Hezbullah propaganda machine was amazingly prepared for this tragedy. Anyone can be a martyr, you know...

gg

The Israelis had sent messages in to Qana a week before this event advising them to evacuate the area. If they were still there, you have to suspect that Hezbollah prevented them from leaving in order to provide propaganda which will be lapped up by the MSM and the metropolitan elites in the west.

daytripper

this is not news. if our political masters can engage in propaganda then so can they. bitching about this comes across as being very naive.

spanner

It would certainly be disgusting to stage these photographs for the purposes of propaganda. But it is important that the consequences of war be documented.

This war is a completely disproportionate response compared to the losses the Israelis have suffered.

Would the poster have advocated a full-scale invasion of Ireland because of the atrocities carried out by the IRA?

I agree that terrorists should never be negotiated with. This war will, in my opinion, just serve to swell the ranks of jihadis the world over.

Justin

You should indulge more in the American media, which has been thankfully very pro-Israel in this conflict. Although sometimes they have downplayed the religious divisions in Lebanon in a very sloppy fasion.

Parcifal

Its clear that Hezbollah are using civilians close to their rocket-launches to bleed the hearts of the euro-weenies, and is another sign of Jihadi depravity.
Thanks for the post DV, and clearing up the confusion.

Poosh

I believe the building did not "explode" until well after Israeli air-strikes. Thus either terrorists blew it up to use as anti-Jewish propaganda or there were munitions etc in the building which took a while to denonate.

Monty

Daytripper, I agree that such a cynical manipulation of the media would indeed be disgusting. But assuming what I think to be the case, they were not documenting the war, they were accumulating propaganda.

I've got a real issue over this argument of what is proportional and what is not based on body count. The Israelis would have suffered equal or greater losses had the populace there not been able to make use of bomb shelters - a legacy of the constant threat Israelis live under.

I've also got a real issue over the IRA comparison you make. The IRA terrorism was spawned of a political objective, however unrealistic the aim and unacceptable the means. The Hezbollah terrorism and that of other Islamist groups is spawned of a religious inspired desire to wipe out the Jewish race.

I'm glad you agree that terrorists should never be negotiated with. It is just as well because these Islamists do not want to negotiate. Their position is absolute. I set out to explain why in my comment here... The ranks of the jihadis are already swollen because of the likes of Yusuf al-Qaradawi, who inspires them with comments such as "Europe is next".

Allan@Aberdeen

Look at the EU Referendum link again and fix in your mind the picture of the 'worker' who poses with the dead infants (I note that the first one has clearly been dead a lot longer than the second). Now check this article

http://www.bintjbeil.com/E/occupation/robert_fisk_qana.html


from the so-called first Qana massacre ten years previously, by Robert Fisk, no less. Now check out the 'worker' holding up the toddler with its head missing (but strangely, no evident damage to the rest of the corpse). IT'S THE SAME 'WORKER'.
Robert Fisk has never been more useful, and neither has the internet. This has been highlighted at Biased BBC.
Would any lefties like to advance a theory? Any of the usual BS will do.

Allan@Aberdeen

Update from EU Referendum:

http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/07/who-is-this-man.html

And the Israelis have stated that there was a time lapse of about seven hours between the building being hit, and its collapse due to "some unknown reason". Surely Hizbollah wouldn't have put people in there and then destroyed the building? I mean, the kind of people who would do that would be the kind of people who cut off heads, and launch missiles into civilian areas etc.

daytripper

at least your all coming round to the notion that there may be substance to "conspiracy theories"

Allan@Aberdeen

Did daytripper bother to look at the links and offer an opinion? No.

gudone

is the function of daytripper on ATW?
...to constantly equivocate and draw false parallels??

daytripper

gudone, what im saying is the west exploits propaganda, and from the links its apparent that the east does too.

big deal. its not news.

Dumbjon

Yep, Daytripper, you've broke the code. Who can forget those shots of Tony Blair parading round with a dead infant for hours on end ?

No, wait....I must have forgot them. Hey, surely you're not try to draw some insane (and inane) moral equivalence ?

Hello ? Bottom line here: dead babies !=props. The mere fact of seeing a dead kid and thinking 'hey, that's exactly what we need!' pretty much bars you from membership of the 'civilised humans club'. It certainly casts a revealing light on why the Israelis might suspect your bona fides when you talk of 'peace'.

Allan@Aberdeen

I asked the left to provide the usual BS and daytripper has obliged. It is wrong to consider this fabrication as mere propaganda of which the west (Israel) is as guilty of producing as muslims. There is no way that Jews would have or ever have displayed the bodies of children in such a manner, yet photographers from the west co-operated in the whole sick charade orchestrated by Hizbollah. There are those such as daytripper who think "big deal, it's not news". It ought to be news because it shows the sick mindset of the Hizbollah and their moon-god cult.

Technical Glitch

If any of you have used a digital camera, you'll find that most of them have a clock which attaches a timestamp to whatever photographs you take with the camera. You can also reset the clock. Usually if you take out the batteries for any extended period of time, you have to reset the clock.

It's quite possible for two photographs taken at exactly the same time and at the same place by two different cameras to have different timestamps, simply because the cameras had their clocks set by different people. If you're dealing with press photographers who may be normally based in different time zones, you will get timestamps varying by hours for photographs taken at the same time.

What matters are the sequences of photographs taken by each individual camera. And even then, if the clock on a camera is reset due to any number of possible reasons, photographs may erroneously appear to be out of sequence.

The death of ANY child is a terrible thing.

<sarcasm>Guys, they're only Muslims. "Nits will be lice", as Cromwell said about this site's other favourite hate-group. That baby had refused to evacuate its village when the Israeli army had told it to, so it was obviously a Hezbollah supporter and deserved what was coming to it. Stop being such wusses. Celebrate the demise of one more Islamofascist terrorist. You know you want to.</sarcasm>

However using that death to propagate a political view by staging a photo call of the corpse is profoundly cynical and revolting.

Watching the hate-filled, spittle-flecked sociopaths on this site and on EUReferendum trying to nit-pick details of photograph timestamps so as to minimise and make excuses for the slaughter of civilians is profoundly revolting too.

At the very least, the Israeli air force committed a serious blunder in Qana. Do none of you have the common humanity to acknowledge that much? It doesn't require you to oppose the military campaign. Just to admit that a disastrous mistake was made that cost the lives of uninvolved civilians.

The photographs may well have been posed for the cameras - almost any press photograph is posed to some extent - but the deaths they show are quite obviously genuine. I have no doubt that Hezbollah gratefully seized upon the slaughter as a propaganda coup. But it doesn't mean that the slaughter didn't take place in the way that they said it did.

Mike's America

Thanks Tech Glitch... always nice to get the Hezbollah perspective.

And Dateraper is right on target with the usual shades of gray.

One thing is for sure. Follow the lead of either of these two and we've never have the kind of accountability that prevents wars, we'll just endlessly kvetch about the latest in a never ending and ever more deadly spiral.

I have to agree with Justin, that much of the all day American media coverage was sloppy. I kept watching it waiting for one of the anchors to point out that the first video they were showing was over a week old.

But the point of that video and all that which has surfaced since clearly shows that the Hezboos are using civilian structures for cover.

I'm waiting now for all you lefties who thought our benevolent treatment of homocidal terrorists at Guantanamo was a violation of the Geneva Conventions to condemn the Hezboos for their violations which led to this tragedy....
.... still waiting....stttillll waaaiiitting...

Another thing that gets lost in the hysterics is the fact that the media are taken to the scene of these attacks by the Hezboo media folks. The media isn't just camped all over Lebanon waiting for a bomb to fall.

In the case of the attack at Qana, reporters did not arrive on the scene until many hours after the attack.

Is it any wonder that they did not find any evidence of rocket launchers or bodies of dead fighters among the rubble when they were brought to the scene by their handlers?

And reporters were able to both enter the area and exit. One wonders why the civilians, who were warned for weeks to leave, could not?

P.S. Perhaps the moral equivalence dullards can explain away this video which shows Hamas fighters in Gaza using UN ambulances to carry away retreating, but uninjured fighters:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqGjz7iJTns

It's not like the Hezboos have a monopoly on violating the Geneva Conventions. But who cares? We don't hold terrorists accountable for their actions do we? Only those who are trying to defeat this evil.

daytripper

bush senior couldnt get support for gulf war one until he wheeled out the dead babies and stolen incubators.

not that much difference.

Allan@Aberdeen

This is from another, current thread.


A gross calumny by Daniel Bright on Allah's Apostle: his last wife was 9 (nine) years old and not 6. Shame on you, Daniel.

Posted by: Allan@Aberdeen | July 30, 2006 at 10:07 PM

many kings took very young wives. dont judge your history by todays standards. utter folly.

Posted by: daytripper | July 30, 2006 at 11:32 PM

A 9 (nine) year-old girl??!! Repeat, a nine-year-old girl??!! Get real, man!

Posted by: Allan@Aberdeen | July 31, 2006 at 12:16 AM

Tripper will justify and excuse just about anything. It's an amazing ability of every leftist.

Posted by: Monica-Philadelphia | July 31, 2006 at 06:03 AM


This is just so that everyone can see where Daytripper is coming from. Hmmm. Looks like 'dateraper' is indeed appropriate.

Mike's America

Allan: "Dateraper" does seem a good description. I've never seen him make one comment that wasn't laced with the moral equivalence used to excuse every evil in the world.

And he calls the U.S. "predjudiced and ignorant?"

Pffft!

daytripper

personal attack. the last bastion.

let. me. repeat.

EVERYONE EXPLOITS INFORMATION FOR PROPAGANDA.

im excusing no evil, merely pointing out that your finger wagging at this incident is utterly pointless.
its tasteless yes, but stop acting like western media is immune from similar exploitation.

aileen

I couldn't find the origonal thread about the 9 yr old. So I'll ask here. Do we know that he actually had sex with her at that yound age. The practice with the kings and nobles of marrying children was not uncommon but they generally held back and gave her a chance to be a viable breeding machine. Henry Tudor's mother was a bit of an exception, giving birth at 13 (I think). (The Queen is a direct decendant). It is worth noting that she didn't have any more.

Colm

Well reading many of the comments above only shows that the Right are just as capable of believing barmy conspiracy theories and engaging in twisted moralities (outraged more by the showing of dead babies than the killing of those same babies) as they often accuse the left of.

Allan@Aberdeen

Daytripper wrote:

"personal attack. the last bastion."

No, daytripper. I only displayed your own writings and allowed others to judge you by them.

Now on the subject matter, and thinking back to the suicide bomber campaign in Israel as conducted in the name of Allah and the 72 virgins: does anyone remember any member of any of the Israeli civil authorities displaying the dead as trophies for the press photographers? In case the word 'trophy' is considered inappropriate by the caring, delicate souls on the left, I'd point you back to the photographs taken of Mr Green Helmet in the links cited and you'll see him holding the dead children as trophies.

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